[00:00:00] Dr. Katie Deming MD: What if you could use hypnosis? To reduce stress and facilitate healing in the body. I sit down with penny chasen a former nurse anesthetist Turned hypnosis expert penny breaks down the science behind hypnosis I'm little bit about hypnosis, explaining how it works to bypass your critical mind and access the subconscious, where real transformation takes place.[00:00:23] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Learn how hypnosis can help you manage pain. Reduce stress and unlock your body's innate [00:00:30] ability to heal from stressed out nurses to those battling chronic illnesses. Penny has helped them find peace and balance in their lives. Stay until the end as she guides you through a powerful breathing technique that you can start using today to help anchor relaxation and calm into your daily life.

[00:00:49] Dr. Katie Deming MD: You're listening to the Born to Heal podcast, and I'm your host, Dr. Katie Deming. After two decades of practicing as an oncologist and caring [00:01:00] for thousands of patients, I've seen firsthand how our healthcare system places obstacles in your path to true healing. My guests and I will bridge the worlds of Western medicine and alternative healing to help you achieve optimal health.

[00:01:14] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Expect to uncover new insights, share a few laughs, and maybe even shed some tears. But most of all, we'll learn how to heal from within together. So let's dive into today's episode.

[00:01:27] Dr. Katie Deming MD: If hypnosis works, okay. [00:01:30] Does it really mean that the illness is only in someone's

[00:01:33] Penny Chiasson: head? Absolutely not. As a hypnotist who's done thousands of hours of hypnosis and hypnotherapy sessions, it's more about the perception of what we're experiencing.

[00:01:45] Penny Chiasson: We can have a true physical issue going on. And through hypnosis, We alter the perception of it. It does not mean that it is not there.

[00:01:57] Dr. Katie Deming MD: So it doesn't mean that it's not real, [00:02:00] but hypnosis can be effective because with hypnosis you're altering that person's perception of the illness or whatever is happening in their body.

[00:02:11] Penny Chiasson: Correct. Hypnosis has been successfully used to completely block pain for surgeries. And surgery is very real. We know that that's a very real injury, but you can use hypnosis to block that and personally [00:02:30] experiencing the blocking of pain or analgesia through hypnosis was the deciding factor that I became a practicing hypnotist.

[00:02:40] Penny Chiasson: Because that was never my plan. I took the training out of curiosity to learn more about what I had found in the medical research, working as an anesthetist. But in that training, one day the instructor called up a volunteer who happened to be me, and he guided me into a deep [00:03:00] state of hypnosis. He gave me suggestions that I was completely numb on the back of my hand, and he clamped a surgical clamp shut on the back of my hand so tightly, in fact, that it left the mark on my skin for two and a half hours.

[00:03:13] Penny Chiasson: And I never felt a thing.

[00:03:17] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Wow. So that was your first introduction to hypnosis for pain.

[00:03:23] Penny Chiasson: Yes. That was day five of my basic hypnosis certification training. And I walked out that day, I called my [00:03:30] husband, I said, Hey, honey, guess what? I'm opening a hypnosis practice. And he was like, what the heck, what?

[00:03:38] Dr. Katie Deming MD: That is an amazing story.

[00:03:40] Dr. Katie Deming MD: And so you really initially went in, this was a training to kind of add on to your practice as a nurse, the anesthetist, and then this became something where you realized, wow, there's real value here, and I want to Add this, was it initially adding it to your [00:04:00] practice as an anesthetist or?

[00:04:01] Penny Chiasson: Well, I wasn't sure what I was going to do with it.

[00:04:05] Penny Chiasson: In 2008, there was a sentinel event at our hospital where there was, use of a benzodiazepine alongside of a narcotic and there was a bad outcome. And I realized as a nurse anesthetist, I learned a lot about pain that I didn't as a nurse. So that was, this was my first entrepreneurial hair. I decided I'm going to create a CE course for nurses.

[00:04:28] Penny Chiasson: And when I began [00:04:30] looking at sedation scales, and I'm like, okay, well what if someone is sedated, but they're still having pain? Like, what can nurses do? So I went down the rabbit hole of complementary, complementary, and adjunct techniques for pain management. And that was where I uncovered the actual medical research around hypnosis and pain.

[00:04:49] Penny Chiasson: It's actually one of the most highly studied areas of hypnosis. So it w it was always in the back of my mind. And then in 2012, I came across an [00:05:00] advertisement for hypnosis certification by a retired nurse anesthetist. And you and I both have been through credentialing process. So Knowing where you're getting your training from is important.

[00:05:13] Penny Chiasson: So I opted to go to that hypnosis certification and was just going to get some anesthesia credits. Learn a little bit more about it. I was literally just hypno curious as I like to call it.

[00:05:27] Dr. Katie Deming MD: I Love that and so tell us can [00:05:30] you tell the audience? What is hypnosis, you know, and how does it work?

[00:05:36] Penny Chiasson: So hypnosis is really just a state of focused attention and a little bit more technical description of it would be so that we can bypass the critical factor and receive suggestions for change that we want in our life.

[00:05:51] Penny Chiasson: The critical factor is basically the analytical critical thinking part of your mind. So basically you go into a state of focused [00:06:00] attention where you're not actively thinking and questioning everything and you allow yourself to receive suggestions or you give yourself suggestions. For what it is that you want to change, see differently, be open to in your life, be it beliefs, habits, or behaviors.

[00:06:18] Dr. Katie Deming MD: and how exactly, what is happening through hypnosis? What is it that you're, you know, accessing to help people, you know, move past that, [00:06:30] did you call it the critical mind? The critical factor. The critical factor. How does hypnosis work to get people past that?

[00:06:37] Penny Chiasson: That's a very good question. And I'm going to tell you that no one exactly knows.

[00:06:42] Penny Chiasson: People are still attempting to figure out exactly how hypnosis works, exactly how one bypasses that critical factor, but we tend to be more in our right brain when we're in hypnosis, and the limbic system of the brain is [00:07:00] more active, and that's basically the area of the brain where we access memories, where our imagination is, where we determine our state of well being, right?

[00:07:11] Penny Chiasson: Should we be in fear? Are we safe and secure? So all of those things come into play there. And that is then interconnected to how our body responds to our environment. So they do know that when we're in a hypnotic state, We are more suggestible, they don't understand the [00:07:30] exact mechanism, and we're also influencing this part of the brain that accesses our memories, our anticipation, our emotions, and determines our state of well being.

[00:07:41] Penny Chiasson: And it's believed or hypothesized that that's where some of the influence comes in as to how we respond and react to stress. and healing.

[00:07:51] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Great. And when you say that part of the brain that accesses memory and these other pieces, is this the [00:08:00] subconscious that you're speaking of when you say that?

[00:08:02] Penny Chiasson: One could, one could say that memories are a part of the subconscious. If we think of the subconscious as the part of the mind that processes our experiences, And puts perceptions into place and how we interpret our world.

[00:08:18] Penny Chiasson: This is my definition. I'm not a scientist, but my definition of the subconscious is it's that part of our mind, where we are perceiving interpreting and responding to the world so all of those [00:08:30] things do come into play there. A lot of people will say it's the conscious mind, and it's the unconscious mind.

[00:08:37] Penny Chiasson: I tend to look at it from the medical model, where it's the conscious, the subconscious, and the unconscious, with the unconscious part of the mind being that automatic heart. Our reflexes, our heart rate, our breathing, the things that aren't under the influence of our perceptions.

[00:08:56] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Got it. I think, I think it's helpful just because on this [00:09:00] podcast, we've talked about the conscious mind and the, the subconscious mind, and you're bringing up something, you know, that we haven't talked about before, which is the unconscious and the reflexes and the breathing. And so in. The unconscious, from the way that I think about that, is that's the stuff that we never even need to think about.

[00:09:21] Dr. Katie Deming MD: It just happens reflexively. Our body is designed to do the things that it needs to do. Like your heart beats, and we breathe, [00:09:30] and we have reflexes that pull us away from pain. All of those things are unconscious. When you're talking about hypnosis and the influence, does it influence the unconscious mind as well?

[00:09:43] Dr. Katie Deming MD: In addition, or?

[00:09:45] Penny Chiasson: Yes, it can because when we have a classically conditioned habit, then that is within the unconscious mind. So what hypnosis will help us to do is to create a new neural [00:10:00] pathway in a new habit that will overtake that classically conditioned habit. But the other pieces. There's something called the reticular activating system, and the reticular activating system is in this reptilian part of the brain that is in the unconscious mind, and it has a pure, purpose of survival.

[00:10:19] Penny Chiasson: So what the reticular activating system does, first of all, when you're asleep and something goes bump in the night, It's the guard dog that has one ear cocked up that wakes you up when there's a bump [00:10:30] in the night. The other thing that it does is it takes the information that we process visually and through our hearing and it helps our subconscious mind to prioritize the information that we believe is essential to our survival.

[00:10:48] Penny Chiasson: This becomes very important when we are dealing with illness. And with healing, because if we speak to ourselves in a way that we are [00:11:00] creating the expectation that good things are going to happen, then we have that glass half full. Basically, we can receive a lot of information, but the information that is going to filter through that critical factor and is going to come into our awareness and perception is going to be the information that supports our state of being.

[00:11:25] Penny Chiasson: If we have a class half empty approach, [00:11:30] someone could come to us and they could give us information around a treatment or a diagnosis that's 90 percent positive. But if we have talked to ourselves in a way that we've programmed the subconscious through the reticular activating system to look for the negative, that 10% is what's going to stick.

[00:11:51] Penny Chiasson: So that is how the unconscious and the subconscious work together just for our basic well being and state of [00:12:00] survival. Okay. I

[00:12:00] Dr. Katie Deming MD: think that that's really helpful to understand that basically what you're doing is the reticular activating system takes in sensory information, like you said, visually or auditorily, and then it prioritizes what is necessary for our survival.

[00:12:16] Dr. Katie Deming MD: And that's kind of born into us. And then also by our conditioning of how we are raised and everything that we've, we've experienced, but What you can do with hypnosis is shift that prioritization so that we're not always [00:12:30] looking for the negative per se. And so by shifting that perspective, then you start to see more of the glass half full versus the glass half empty.

[00:12:40] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Do I have that correct?

[00:12:41] Penny Chiasson: Yes. And you don't even need hypnosis to do that. It's our self talk in the way that we talk to other people about our problems and their problems because the conscious mind can only process seven to nine bits of information a [00:13:00] second. Think of a phone number. You can pretty quickly memorize a phone number.

[00:13:04] Penny Chiasson: If I were to give you an 18 digit number, that would be a little more challenging. Some people who've really trained their mind could do it. Most average people wouldn't be able to. The subconscious. It takes in and processes 20 million bits of information or more per second. If we had to actively be aware of all of that information, we would exhaust our brains and then we wouldn't [00:13:30] be at the ready if we needed to protect ourselves because that's all our brain cares about.

[00:13:34] Penny Chiasson: How am I going to survive today? So the reticular activating system tells the subconscious mind we are basically looking for confirmation bias. around this particular subject. This is why three people could watch the same news channel. and watch the same piece of news and have three completely different [00:14:00] interpretations of that news because we have different filters based on the conversations that we've had, the perspectives that we've taken, and our beliefs around that.

[00:14:11] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Yes. And we know this actually from in crimes, when a crime happens, you'll have eyewitnesses who are all there and document different experiences for exactly this reason of what you're describing. It's our perception. And I love that you've broken that [00:14:30] down to really help people understand what is happening there with the reticular activating, activating system, and that it's a way for us to.

[00:14:39] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Not exhaust ourselves by paying attention to everything all the time. It pays attention to the things that we in our own personal experience need to pay attention to because those are the things that have threatened our survival in the past.

[00:14:54] Penny Chiasson: I mean, it's truly an instinctual mechanism because there was a time when we were hunter gatherers [00:15:00] and you had to know what it sounded like when a deer was walking through the woods because That deer may mean the difference between you starving to death and you surviving the winter.

[00:15:11] Penny Chiasson: So it's a very primitive mechanism. But what has happened is in this day and age where we're constantly being bombarded with information and expectations and judgments and all of these things, this part of the mind can't tell the difference between what's true life or death and what's of [00:15:30] perceived importance for us to fit in and be a part of the tribe.

[00:15:35] Penny Chiasson: Which is part of our survival. It actually influences our identity to a degree.

[00:15:41] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Yeah, well, and actually I love that you just brought up identity because I want, I would like to talk about this about identity as it ties to people who are dealing with illness. And this is something that for me,I've been really interested in and actually with my TED [00:16:00] talk with talking about survivor, I talk about the potential dangers of language, but actually the one thing I didn't talk about in that talk is identity, which is huge.

[00:16:10] Dr. Katie Deming MD: So I want you to talk about this, talking about the identity of someone who is sick and what we can do around identity to have more empowerment and also more powerful outcomes.

[00:16:24] Penny Chiasson: Yeah, so identity is basically our beliefs. It comes down [00:16:30] to our I am statement. I am healthy. I am well. I am a healer or I am dying.

[00:16:40] Penny Chiasson: So it really plays a role because remember I spoke earlier about the limbic system and our emotions and our survival. If our beliefs and our identity. Is of something that is not aligned with our health, our wholeness, our wellness, our [00:17:00] thriving, it's going to activate the fear centers of the brain. It may be at a very low level that we don't realize it.

[00:17:06] Penny Chiasson: Or it could be at a very intense level in the case of someone who really worries and they're experiencing anxiety and panic attacks. There's a whole continuum. When we activate the fear centers of the brain a little bit or a lot, we are getting activation of what some people refer to as the psycho neuro immunological axis.

[00:17:28] Penny Chiasson: And all that means is a big fancy [00:17:30] word for how our thoughts, beliefs, mental and emotional health. Impacts the way that our brain regulates our hormonal in our immune states and stress is a good thing if we are driving down the highway and all of a sudden someone cuts us off and our car goes off the road.

[00:17:52] Penny Chiasson: And we're injured. Stress is a good thing. It immediately kicks our body into survival so that [00:18:00] it can protect itself from infection and injury and all of those things. Chronic low level stress actually impedes the ability of the immune system to function properly. It causes us to experience stress all the way down to the cellular level.

[00:18:18] Penny Chiasson: And that, of course, as you know, is. Where cancer comes in to play,there being an impact at the cellular level that cells are not reproducing [00:18:30] properly. So when we look at our identity, if we are identifying as someone who is healthy, if we're identifying as someone who heals their body, who can be whole, then we're taking the fear out of that.

[00:18:46] Penny Chiasson: We're decreasing that stress response, and when we decrease that stress response, we create room and space within the body for the body to create its own healing. And I have to, really from an ethical point of view, be very [00:19:00] clear that hypnosis in and of itself does not heal, treat, or cure anything. It creates the space and the opportunity within the body for the body to heal itself.

[00:19:12] Penny Chiasson: And it may simply be the opposite. You know, take someone, for example, who might have been told they're in a terminal state and you might think, well, Penny, I am dying. That's what they told me. I am dying. Well, maybe your body is having a [00:19:30] challenging time overcoming and healing, but you can still be someone who says, I am living.

[00:19:36] Dr. Katie Deming MD: I am living right now. I am living in this moment. And I am present so that you can take that and create that piece. that allows your innate healing abilities to take over. I'm like, yes, yes, yes, people can see me over here. I'm like, this is it. So we we've, I've talked about this a lot, that actually a state of peace is where the [00:20:00] body.

[00:20:01] Dr. Katie Deming MD: It heals itself. Like we're designed to heal and our bodies are designed to do this, but we have to create that sense of peace. And I love what you're saying here is that identity is one way that we either move away from that piece because we allow the fear response. And honestly, I think for people with cancer.

[00:20:24] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Or other chronic illnesses, but cancer is the one that I've spent the most time around. Fear is [00:20:30] like the ever present companion. And, you know, I remember saying to my mom at one point when she was sick that, you know, fear, if, if we can mitigate this fear, if we can help you start to lessen it. It really will help your body.

[00:20:47] Dr. Katie Deming MD: And she said to me, it's normal to be afraid. I have cancer. It's normal. And I think what I want people to understand in this conversation that we're having today is that it can be [00:21:00] normal. And also there are ways for us to shift it. Yes. It's normal for people to experience fear with cancer. And we don't want to stay there, because just like what you described, is that when we're in fear, it's affecting our cellular functioning of our body.

[00:21:19] Dr. Katie Deming MD: And so, I love that identity is a way that we can shift. away from that identity of illness and identifying with the fear and [00:21:30] embodying, even if it's just in the moment. And the truth is, is that all of us have, the only thing we have is right here in this moment. And I love that, that I'm living. I, I'm in this moment, I'm alive.

[00:21:43] Dr. Katie Deming MD: And there's so much power to that. So let me ask you this, how What are some of the ways that someone can shift their identity? You talked about self talk, so the things that we're telling ourselves, and like you just said, you know, the way that you're speaking to yourselves, but how would [00:22:00] someone go about shifting that identity?

[00:22:02] Penny Chiasson: I think that's a great question because there are many ways that we can tap the subconscious and the subconscious is going to be the fastest way,to do that. What I would do, and, and I take my clients through this,I ask them what it is that they want, you know, what, what, what is the benefit of the change?

[00:22:23] Penny Chiasson: And then I'll ask them, if you already believed this, who are you? And [00:22:30] the answers that may come through are, I am joy, I am peace, I am a loving mother, I can trust myself. So some beliefs begin to come through there in the I am. some people will have funny words that they use for themselves where they identify with the energy, the courage.

[00:22:51] Penny Chiasson: So it might be I am courageous. It might be, I am brave. When you have those statements down, I am, then say, okay, [00:23:00] if I am joy, what do I believe? If I am joy, I believe I can find happiness and pleasure in the smallest of moments. I believe I can be present. I believe that no matter what happens, there's always something good in it for me.

[00:23:15] Penny Chiasson: That only good comes to me

[00:23:17] Penny Chiasson: when you write these things down. You want to really lean into the feeling of it before we hit record you and I were talking a little bit about emotion. Emotion is a way to tap right into the [00:23:30] subconscious. And sometimes when we write these I am statements or I believe statements, sometimes they feel a little bit out of reach.

[00:23:39] Penny Chiasson: So I like to have people start general, where I believe I can decide to be healthy, or I believe I can be healthy. I can allow my body to begin to heal. That's a very general statement. We're not getting really specific. And then script or write out those additional statements. [00:24:00] And as you write them down, you know, I am joy.

[00:24:04] Penny Chiasson: I am peace. I enjoy the special moments in my life. I enjoy the average moments in my life. I can find appreciation in everything. You feel how that energy changes? Through that process, we want to bring that energy in and that emotion will begin to help create a positive association. Between those statements, because our mind likes to move away from [00:24:30] pain and into pleasure.

[00:24:31] Penny Chiasson: So we're also tapping into that piece of it. And then every day, read your script that you wrote. And if you want to change it, change it, adapt it, play with it. It may become more and more specific as you go. But that is a very good beginning. I only say positive and helpful statements to myself.

[00:24:52] Dr. Katie Deming MD: This is such a powerful exercise to do for anyone actually is to, and I [00:25:00] love that you mentioned this about the emotion that really tapping into the emotion and this kind of stair stepping too, that sometimes it feels out of reach to say, you know, I am healed, but you could stair step, like you said. I believe it's possible for me to heal and get yourself to that place where you have the very powerful IM statements that sometimes it takes us working our way up to those really bold [00:25:30] statements because you don't want to pick a statement that feels so untrue that you feel uneasy about it because it's basically the reverse, right?

[00:25:37] Dr. Katie Deming MD: You're doing the opposite of what you want.

[00:25:39] Penny Chiasson: Yeah. You just literally triggered that protective mechanism that goes, this is BS. Yeah, this is BS. You're drinking the Kool Aid. Yes, we're going to drink the Kool Aid, but we're going to, we're going to tiptoe, tiptoe into the water.

[00:25:51] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Perfect. So I think that this exercise could be very powerful for if, for whatever you want to create.

[00:25:59] Dr. Katie Deming MD: So we're [00:26:00] talking here specifically about illness. But it could be about whatever you want to create in your life using these I am statements and then anchoring it with that emotion that really anchors that I am statement into our subconscious through the emotion. It's beautiful.

[00:26:17] Penny Chiasson: I was going to say a really easy hack. If you're someone who you're think you might forget to read through those set reminders. on your phone and label the reminder. [00:26:30] So when the reminder pops up on your phone, it's just right there. I am healing every day. I'm stronger, whatever it is. Beautiful.

[00:26:37] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Yeah, and I know some people who put it as the screensaver on their phone.

[00:26:41] Dr. Katie Deming MD: They'll like kind of write it out and then, you know, snap a photo of it and it's at their screensaver. So every time they turn on their phone, they see it there as well. Um, so I love that of, of having the reminders. Yeah. And, you know, I'd like to talk just quickly, one of the things that I [00:27:00] find when I talk to clients about hypnosis is sometimes they get nervous, like, what is this person going to program into my mind?

[00:27:06] Dr. Katie Deming MD: And I'm wondering, can you talk about with hypnosis? Are you putting someone out? Are you putting them under? Is someone going to adopt beliefs that don't fit with what they believe? is that process? What's happening there? Just to alleviate people's fear so they understand if they were to work with a hypnotist or if they were to do hypnosis audios, you know, [00:27:30] what is happening there and, and what is, how much control do they have over what is taken in?

[00:27:36] Penny Chiasson: Yeah. So once again, it's that state of focused attention and you will hear if you're working with a hypnotist, you'll hear everything that's said to you. I have explained to clients in the past, you're not going to be out. You're not under, you hear everything that I say. If at any time you need, cause I work virtually with clients.

[00:27:55] Penny Chiasson: I don't see people in person in office. I'll tell people if someone comes and [00:28:00] rings the bell, You will be able to safely get up and answer the door. Or if you need to go to the restroom, you can safely get up and go to the restroom and, and come back and we'll pick up where we left off. And it never fails that, frequently I'll have someone after the fact, they're like, but I don't, I'm not sure I was in hypnosis.

[00:28:16] Penny Chiasson: And I'll say, what do you mean? Well, I heard every word you said. I'm like, yes, I told you, you would hear every word that I said. And that just goes back to those preconceived notions. When you're working with a professional hypnotist, They are going to give you [00:28:30] suggestions around the desired outcome. that that you have.

[00:28:34] Penny Chiasson: We have normal states of suggestibility where we pick things up all the time. Hypnosis is just choosing to go into a more focused, directed state to receive, receive those suggestions for change. And there are a lot of different techniques. Some It's just script based, which is what hypnosis audios are as well, where you're just receiving suggestions for well being, maybe for being [00:29:00] more optimistic, for sleeping better, and then there are more advanced directed techniques, which include root cause work, emotional release, forgiveness, forgiveness, and a lot more.

[00:29:10] Penny Chiasson: Which is huge. Anger is a big emotion that plays a huge role in disease in the body. So there are more directed techniques. But typically, you know, when you're working with a professional hypnotist, they're working by a code of ethics. There's a standard of practice. And as long as that person is [00:29:30] certified and trained, you're going to be in good hands.

[00:29:32] Dr. Katie Deming MD: That's great. And I think just from myself, so I have experienced, hypnosis and have found it very powerful as a technique and, you know, all the way from just listening to pre recorded audios to having customized, um, hypnosis sessions and then the audios that go with that to, you know, listen to them over time.

[00:29:57] Dr. Katie Deming MD: And it's been very powerful in my own life. So I [00:30:00] definitely, Value this, tool for people and, and want them to understand that it's safe that, you know, they're not being put out and, and having these things kind of programmed into them that, you know, are not desired or wanted. And I love that you said that you're going to hear the things and if something happened, of course, someone, you know, when he's going to listen to a hypnosis audio while they're driving.

[00:30:22] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Or operating machinery. Please don't do that. Driving a car. Please don't, but that, um, that you can hear things and [00:30:30] that you're aware it's just kind of taking you into that state where you're suggestible and able to incorporate these new,concepts and ideas into and beliefs into your subconscious. So I know that you have a technique for anchoring the relaxation response, and I think this would be really helpful for my audience to have a tangible tool that they can use.

[00:30:54] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Can you tell us a little bit about how you've used this and how this tool [00:31:00] has helped? I know that you've used it with other nurses that you work with, and then maybe you can walk us through the exercise.

[00:31:06] Penny Chiasson: So the relaxation response can be activated through breathing. And there's actually a book called The Relaxation Response by Dr.

[00:31:17] Penny Chiasson: Herbert Benson. He's out of Harvard and he wrote about this in the 70s. And when he went on the news circuit, to talk about it. He was actually dismissed because he started talking about how [00:31:30] yogis through breathing could really slow down their heart rate. So that was just a little too forward thinking for the medical community, at the time, but now he has his own cardiology center at Harvard.

[00:31:42] Penny Chiasson: So it just goes to show how times change. Basically, we have a nerve in our body called the vagus nerve. And it has nerve endings in our abdomen, our diaphragm, our lungs, our heart, and basically, it regulates our [00:32:00] blood pressure in tandem with our breathing. So by using a specific breathing technique, we can stimulate our brain to activate The relaxation response, which lowers our blood pressure, and it lowers our heart rate, and it lowers stress chemicals in the body, and it also results in the release of endorphins, serotonin, and melatonin.

[00:32:25] Penny Chiasson: which is all very good for us. So the way that you [00:32:30] do the breath, most people when they take a nice deep breath and you ask them to take a nice deep breath in, they're gonna and throw their shoulders up and back. But that's not what we want to do in this case. When we breathe in, We want to breathe down into our abdomen so that when you breathe in, you actually feel your stomach go out.

[00:32:52] Penny Chiasson: Some people like to put their hand on their stomach and what I'm going to ask you to do in just a moment is [00:33:00] to breathe in for a count of three, to hold it for a count of three, and then to exhale for a count of three. But we're going to go nice, slow, in deep. In,

[00:33:15] Penny Chiasson: hold it. And exhale. Now this time when you do it, I want you to take your thumb and finger. When you inhale and when you hold it, I want you to pinch your thumb and finger together firmly. When you exhale, I want you to [00:33:30] release. So we're going to breathe in.

[00:33:38] Penny Chiasson: Let's do that two more times.

[00:33:49] Penny Chiasson: And one more time. In two, three. Hold it, two, three. And exhale, release and let it [00:34:00] out. Okay, so Pavlov's dogs ring a bell, dog salivates. Most people have heard of that. The breathing and the relaxation is like the salivation. Pinching the thumb and finger together is the ringing of the bell. So we're associating the thumb and the finger with the breathing.

[00:34:18] Penny Chiasson: Now to anchor this in very quickly, I would like to guide you through a relaxation exercise. So if you were driving, if you're out riding a bike, walking the dog, [00:34:30] if you're watching kids or you have food on the stove, just please come back and listen to this part, later. But if you would, just go ahead and take a nice deep breath in, let it out.

[00:34:41] Penny Chiasson: And close your eyes. And as you do, just focus on the natural rhythm of your breath. And as you focus on the rhythm of your breath, just notice how it feels as your chest expands and [00:35:00] relaxes. And the oxygen moving in through your nose and down into your lung. And then the feeling of the warm air as you exhale.

[00:35:12] Penny Chiasson: And take your attention to your arms and notice the feeling of the sleeves on your arms . The light touch, the warmth, the texture. And as you focus your attention on that [00:35:30] sensation, your mind begins to relax. And as your mind begins to relax, you become more aware, more aware of your hands, your breathing, the way that your feet are resting, and tuning to the sound of my voice, focusing only on the sound of my voice.

[00:35:58] Penny Chiasson: In just a [00:36:00] moment, I'm going to once again take you through this breathing exercise, but with each instruction that I give you, you find that you become more and more focused on the sound of my voice. It's as if everything outside simply begins to fade to the background, because you know that you're doing something here for yourself that will help you to be more relaxed, more calm, and more at peace, and allow your body to [00:36:30] create a chemical state for healing.

[00:36:35] Penny Chiasson: So once again, now, I want you to pinch your thumb and finger together. Breathing in, 2, 3. Hold that breath, 2, 3. Now release your thumb and finger as you exhale. Beautiful. Once again, your thumb and finger together as you breathe in, [00:37:00] 2, 3. Hold it, 2, 3. And release as you exhale.

[00:37:09] Penny Chiasson: And one more time, breathing in, two, three, pinching that thumb and finger together, holding it, and now releasing, feeling that relaxation move throughout your entire body. And two more times, pinching the thumb and finger together as you inhale, [00:37:30] two, three, beautiful, holding that breath. And exhale. And here we go one last time, your mind developing a memory as you pinch that thumb and finger together, two, three, holding it, two, three, and releasing as you exhale, two, and three.

[00:37:54] Penny Chiasson: Every hour, if you like, take two or three of these [00:38:00] nice, deep, controlled breaths, pinching your thumb and finger together and then releasing, and very quickly. Within a day or two, or maybe a little longer, three or four, you will begin to notice that your mind, your body, easily relaxes each time you take these breaths.

[00:38:21] Penny Chiasson: And within a week or two, You might simply be able to pinch your thumb and finger together and experience the same [00:38:30] deep relaxation without having to take the breath at all, because it's amazing how the body has memory, how the unconscious mind has memory, and each time you listen to this, your unconscious mind is associating your thumb and finger pinching together with the relaxation from this breath.

[00:38:52] Penny Chiasson: Whenever you're ready, just open your eyes.

[00:38:54] Penny Chiasson: That was wonderful. Oh, you're welcome. The key to this [00:39:00] is every hour or every couple of hours, just take three or four of these breaths. So it takes one minute to take three or four of these breaths, pinching that thumb and finger together and you condition this. And I found this to be very helpful when I worked with nurses who were stressed.

[00:39:18] Penny Chiasson: I would take them around the corner and I would teach them the breath and then what would happen if they got into a tense or stressful situation on the floor with the doctor, with the patient, you know, I mean, things get a little [00:39:30] crazy in the hospital. They would be shocked and amazed that they could simply pinch their thumb and finger together and it would just feel like a wave of relaxation come over their body because their brain became conditioned to release those chemicals.

[00:39:42] Penny Chiasson: when they did that.

[00:39:43] Dr. Katie Deming MD: That is so powerful. And I'm so glad. Thank you so much for sharing that practice with us. And yeah, I'm definitely going to practice that because this is something that I think is really important, especially for those listeners who are [00:40:00] experiencing illness is finding These simple techniques that you can calm yourself in the moment.

[00:40:06] Dr. Katie Deming MD: So thank you so much for sharing this and thank you Penny for being here with us today. I'm wondering if people want to find more about you, where can they find you?

[00:40:16] Penny Chiasson: Well, I'm over on Instagram at Penny Do Chaison. Um, I'm on Facebook as well, penny Chase on, or they can go to the website, penny chase on.com.

[00:40:27] Penny Chiasson: I have a podcast there. You can listen and just get to know me [00:40:30] better.

[00:40:30] Dr. Katie Deming MD: I love it. And can you spell your last name just so people know how to spell that?

[00:40:34] Penny Chiasson: Yes, because it's not spelled the way it sounds. C H I A S S O N.

[00:40:41] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Well, Penny, thank you so much for being here with us today. It was a privilege and a pleasure to chat with you.

[00:40:47] Dr. Katie Deming MD: And I know that our listeners are going to enjoy this episode. So thank you so much.

[00:40:51] Penny Chiasson: Thank you for having me. I really appreciated the conversation.

[00:40:54] Dr. Katie Deming MD: Thank you for joining me [00:41:00] on Born to Heal. It's been a privilege to share this time with you, and I hope that today's episode has offered you valuable insights on your journey toward optimal health. Please consider subscribing, sharing this podcast with your friends, and leaving us a review. To learn more about how you can work with me, please visit katydemming.

[00:41:19] Dr. Katie Deming MD: com. You can find additional resources in the episode show notes linked below, and remember to join us next week as we continue to explore more holistic approaches to [00:41:30] healing. Until then, this is Dr. Katie Deming reminding you that just like me, you were born to heal.